The Titus debacle - place the fault squarely with Mayhew
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The Titus debacle - place the fault squarely with Mayhew
by Guest Sat Dec 01, 2012 2:57 pm
Read today with interest, but not surprise, Titus Young's terse exchange with the Detroit media and a teammates reaction to it (not good). Now there is speculation that his days in Detroit are numbered. Like the Broyles pick, I remember several of us openly wondering why the Lions picked Young, when, again like in 2012, defense in the back seven was so severely lacking. To their credit, the Lions did go out last year and sign Tullock, Houston, Durant and Eric Wright. But these guys are marginal talents as the last two years have shown and, Wright was allowed to walk. But aside from Megatron, picking WRs high in the draft has been a disaster for the Lions and Mayhew, who was part of the Millen disaster, should have known better. In addition to the wasted WR picks since 2002 (including Derrick Williams) the Lions wasted valuable salary cap money on Az-Hakim and and Bryant Johnson. Now they are again facing the prospect of having wasted another WR pick (Young), maybe two (Broyles) while their thin defense can't get off the field on third downs and gives up 90 plus yard drives at home while squandering leads. I place the blame for the Young situation not on the player, but squarely on Mayhew because the team didn't do their due diligence before picking him. I refuse to believe that the pouty, selfish, childish character we are witnessing today is an aberration and that Young didn't have those same issues at Boise State that a competent could not have discovered beforehand. Worst still, over the years, selfishness and me-first attitudes are characterisics of many WRs. They tend to be the biggest crybabies in football. This level of incompetence by the Lion brass in picking Young is very Millen like and shows that they learned nothing from their recent woeful draft history. This is one reason they languish behind the Packers and Bears and never move up.
WallyRob - formerly RWalker from the AOL board
WallyRob - formerly RWalker from the AOL board
Guest- Guest
Re: The Titus debacle - place the fault squarely with Mayhew
by SharBar57 Sun Dec 02, 2012 6:26 am
I agree with you 100%, RWalker. Now...what do you think about the Suh situation? I know he hasn't been penalized that much this season on the field; however, I still have reservations about his character and his selfishness as a player. He has had minor problems with the law, but imo, still reflects badly on his overall character. Many say his talent is too great to even consider trading him in the off-season. I tend to disagree and even though the Lions would be losing a great talent, maybe they would be able to pick up a few extra draft picks in return...but then, they would probably waste them as they have done in the past, ie: Titus and the others you mentioned. Just my opinion.
Sharon
Sharon
SharBar57- Posts : 151
Join date : 2012-02-12
Re: The Titus debacle - place the fault squarely with Mayhew
by Guest Mon Dec 03, 2012 12:09 am
[quote="SharBar57"]I agree with you 100%, RWalker. Now...what do you think about the Suh situation? I know he hasn't been penalized that much this season on the field; however, I still have reservations about his character and his selfishness as a player. He has had minor problems with the law, but imo, still reflects badly on his overall character. Many say his talent is too great to even consider trading him in the off-season. I tend to disagree and even though the Lions would be losing a great talent, maybe they would be able to pick up a few extra draft picks in return...but then, they would probably waste them as they have done in the past, ie: Titus and the others you mentioned. Just my opinion.
Sharon
Hey Sharon, thanks for the reply. I may be in the minority on the board, but I don't think Suh should be traded. If he were playing for the Steelers or the Packers I don't think you would see these kind of issues. There is a certain expectation with winning teams and the Lions don't have it. Although Mayhew has become a big part of the problem, the team needs to start all over with a new coaching staff. Suh is still a young talent and I think he can be a building block to a decent team. But coach Schwartz and his staff need to go. 0-4 in the division this year. 0-4 on Thanksgiving. One total division road win in four seasons (they haven't won in Green Bay since 1991 so count that as another loss). Another last place finish this year. The writing is on the wall. If Schwartz were coaching anywhere but Detroit, there would be no further discussion, and his fate would be sealed. But Mayhew like his incompetent GM predecessor and mentor is going to prolong the agony and bring him back.
Sharon
Hey Sharon, thanks for the reply. I may be in the minority on the board, but I don't think Suh should be traded. If he were playing for the Steelers or the Packers I don't think you would see these kind of issues. There is a certain expectation with winning teams and the Lions don't have it. Although Mayhew has become a big part of the problem, the team needs to start all over with a new coaching staff. Suh is still a young talent and I think he can be a building block to a decent team. But coach Schwartz and his staff need to go. 0-4 in the division this year. 0-4 on Thanksgiving. One total division road win in four seasons (they haven't won in Green Bay since 1991 so count that as another loss). Another last place finish this year. The writing is on the wall. If Schwartz were coaching anywhere but Detroit, there would be no further discussion, and his fate would be sealed. But Mayhew like his incompetent GM predecessor and mentor is going to prolong the agony and bring him back.
Guest- Guest
Re: The Titus debacle - place the fault squarely with Mayhew
by SharBar57 Mon Dec 03, 2012 9:13 am
I thought Suh and the DL played very well for the most part; but, when they (defense)needed to contain Luck and the Indy offense they couldn't do it. Well, they really couldn't contain their offense all day. Just as importantly, the Lions kicked field goals whereas they couldn't score TD's! Just another bad day for the Lions. A win they let get away. A complete turnaround from last year where they got all those last minute victories. What a disappointment they have been. My prediction of 8-8 sure was optimistic...hey? They will find it very difficult to win any of the next four games. Another high draft choice anyone? One that will no doubt be for another wide receiver! LOL!
Sharon
Sharon
SharBar57- Posts : 151
Join date : 2012-02-12
Re: The Titus debacle - place the fault squarely with Mayhew
by SharBar57 Mon Dec 03, 2012 9:28 am
As for the coaching...well, I think the Lions simply do not have the defensive talent to contain any relatively competent offense in the league. A good DL will not be able to contain an opposing offense throughout the entire game. The coaches might have the players in the right spot to make a play, but lack of talent makes that irrelevent because the talent isn't there to execute the play. Same as with the offense. Now...imo, anyway, the Lions have the talent in Calvin and Stafford, but the rest of the offense...not so much. And more importantly...the depth just isn't there on "O" or the "D." The depletion of the secondary proves that as does the injuries incurred at WR. Once in awhile the "D" will come through with a big play, but that is few and far between. For the most part the back seven are not very good and you don't win many games with a weak back seven. I think Schwartz and his cronies over estimated their talent pool and thus did not think it necessary to shore it up. As for the "O" Stafford is putting up the numbers as is Calvin, but you can't win with just two great "O" players. The supporting cast on both sides of the ball just don't cut it, and...I don't think different coaches could to any better. Last year no doubtedly was a fluke and the REAL Lions showed up again this year. That's the way I see it.
Sharon
Sharon
SharBar57- Posts : 151
Join date : 2012-02-12
Re: The Titus debacle - place the fault squarely with Mayhew
by SharBar57 Tue Dec 04, 2012 8:38 am
Here is another take on the how the Lions' season has played out...and, if, or what can be done about improving this team from this point forward. A pretty good read:
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SharBar57- Posts : 151
Join date : 2012-02-12
Re: The Titus debacle - place the fault squarely with Mayhew
by Dawildboar Tue Dec 04, 2012 4:43 pm
[quote="WallyRob1249"]
You're right, he will be back and in my opinion he should be. This team didn't quit on him. Two games where crazy Special Teams snatched defeat from the jaws of victory, another rule changed because of a Detroit SNAFU to again snag defeat from the jaws of victory. The Chicago game and Green Bay game was a toss up...They lost because the talent was less than two damn good teams. This week they found another way to lose a game that they should have won, the celebrated 3 minutes too early.
I'm pretty sure there aren't too many teams licking their chops to play the Lions. They're better than their record and part of the blame is on the coach, I think the coordinators are marginal. In my opinion, Gunny and Crossman are not carrying the load, Linehan is the biggest question mark but man, the Lions are a top ranked offense...He frustrating but competent.
Mayhew...The guy brought in talent, Stafford, Best, Titus, Broyles, Sims...Injuries have hurt his results. I know, they were damaged. Guess what? Most player playing big time college football are damaged in some aspect.
The question about getting rid of Suh. I like Suh and think he got a bad rap, which he brought to himself. The bottom line is you can't build an elite team with three elite players...Calvin, Stafford and Suh...See Ya Suh! Send him to the AFC out West.
Schwartzs and Mayhew have one year...
SharBar57 wrote:I agree with you 100%, RWalker. Now...what do you think about the Suh situation? I know he hasn't been penalized that much this season on the field; however, I still have reservations about his character and his selfishness as a player. He has had minor problems with the law, but imo, still reflects badly on his overall character. Many say his talent is too great to even consider trading him in the off-season. I tend to disagree and even though the Lions would be losing a great talent, maybe they would be able to pick up a few extra draft picks in return...but then, they would probably waste them as they have done in the past, ie: Titus and the others you mentioned. Just my opinion.
Sharon
Hey Sharon, thanks for the reply. I may be in the minority on the board, but I don't think Suh should be traded. If he were playing for the Steelers or the Packers I don't think you would see these kind of issues. There is a certain expectation with winning teams and the Lions don't have it. Although Mayhew has become a big part of the problem, the team needs to start all over with a new coaching staff. Suh is still a young talent and I think he can be a building block to a decent team. But coach Schwartz and his staff need to go. 0-4 in the division this year. 0-4 on Thanksgiving. One total division road win in four seasons (they haven't won in Green Bay since 1991 so count that as another loss). Another last place finish this year. The writing is on the wall. If Schwartz were coaching anywhere but Detroit, there would be no further discussion, and his fate would be sealed. But Mayhew like his incompetent GM predecessor and mentor is going to prolong the agony and bring him back.
You're right, he will be back and in my opinion he should be. This team didn't quit on him. Two games where crazy Special Teams snatched defeat from the jaws of victory, another rule changed because of a Detroit SNAFU to again snag defeat from the jaws of victory. The Chicago game and Green Bay game was a toss up...They lost because the talent was less than two damn good teams. This week they found another way to lose a game that they should have won, the celebrated 3 minutes too early.
I'm pretty sure there aren't too many teams licking their chops to play the Lions. They're better than their record and part of the blame is on the coach, I think the coordinators are marginal. In my opinion, Gunny and Crossman are not carrying the load, Linehan is the biggest question mark but man, the Lions are a top ranked offense...He frustrating but competent.
Mayhew...The guy brought in talent, Stafford, Best, Titus, Broyles, Sims...Injuries have hurt his results. I know, they were damaged. Guess what? Most player playing big time college football are damaged in some aspect.
The question about getting rid of Suh. I like Suh and think he got a bad rap, which he brought to himself. The bottom line is you can't build an elite team with three elite players...Calvin, Stafford and Suh...See Ya Suh! Send him to the AFC out West.
Schwartzs and Mayhew have one year...
Dawildboar- Posts : 124
Join date : 2012-02-02
Location : Millersville, MD
Re: The Titus debacle - place the fault squarely with Mayhew
by meiden Wed Dec 05, 2012 3:26 pm
[quote="Dawildboar"]
Boar...on this post I'm not sure I agree with you. I think that the close losses ARE the fault of the coaches and the glaring holes on both sides of the ball (particularly interior OL and DBs) are Mayhews fault. This team hasn't quit but if that is the bar for whether a coach is deserving of some praise, Marinelli deserved some praise! I think Linehan is a horrendous OC. His offense is close to the top but really mainly becuase CJ is amazing and they pass a league most # of times. When the chips are down and the defense is focused Linehan can't coach his way out of a paperbag. My 13 year old daughter has probably predicted his play over 70% of the time.
Cunningham is very average and whoever is calling for the passive/prevent when they have the lead is an absolutely moron. Again I say it...how in the world do coaches keep their jobs when they call plays for the weakness of their team in crunch time? Linehan runs the ball...clearly a weakness of the offense...in crunch time. Cunningham puts pressure on his coverage units (some of the worst in the league for back seven coverage) in crunch time. Really???
The coaches deserve absolutely NOTHING. They will get another year and that's probably the right choice but not because they have earned anything at all.
Finally on Suh...I think it would be classic Millen/Mayhew move to get rid of Suh. How boneheaded would that be to take an immature kid with that elite talent and get rid of him just as he starts hitting the age when players grow up (if they grow up). YOu re-sign Suh as soon as possible and then you coach him. If he gets to 28 or 29 and he still costs you games with boneheaded mistakes then you ship him out as soon as possible.
Bottom line...with so few players with elite talent on this team...particularly on the defense...you don't get rid of one when you have one!
WallyRob1249 wrote:SharBar57 wrote:I agree with you 100%, RWalker. Now...what do you think about the Suh situation? I know he hasn't been penalized that much this season on the field; however, I still have reservations about his character and his selfishness as a player. He has had minor problems with the law, but imo, still reflects badly on his overall character. Many say his talent is too great to even consider trading him in the off-season. I tend to disagree and even though the Lions would be losing a great talent, maybe they would be able to pick up a few extra draft picks in return...but then, they would probably waste them as they have done in the past, ie: Titus and the others you mentioned. Just my opinion.
Sharon
Hey Sharon, thanks for the reply. I may be in the minority on the board, but I don't think Suh should be traded. If he were playing for the Steelers or the Packers I don't think you would see these kind of issues. There is a certain expectation with winning teams and the Lions don't have it. Although Mayhew has become a big part of the problem, the team needs to start all over with a new coaching staff. Suh is still a young talent and I think he can be a building block to a decent team. But coach Schwartz and his staff need to go. 0-4 in the division this year. 0-4 on Thanksgiving. One total division road win in four seasons (they haven't won in Green Bay since 1991 so count that as another loss). Another last place finish this year. The writing is on the wall. If Schwartz were coaching anywhere but Detroit, there would be no further discussion, and his fate would be sealed. But Mayhew like his incompetent GM predecessor and mentor is going to prolong the agony and bring him back.
You're right, he will be back and in my opinion he should be. This team didn't quit on him. Two games where crazy Special Teams snatched defeat from the jaws of victory, another rule changed because of a Detroit SNAFU to again snag defeat from the jaws of victory. The Chicago game and Green Bay game was a toss up...They lost because the talent was less than two damn good teams. This week they found another way to lose a game that they should have won, the celebrated 3 minutes too early.
I'm pretty sure there aren't too many teams licking their chops to play the Lions. They're better than their record and part of the blame is on the coach, I think the coordinators are marginal. In my opinion, Gunny and Crossman are not carrying the load, Linehan is the biggest question mark but man, the Lions are a top ranked offense...He frustrating but competent.
Mayhew...The guy brought in talent, Stafford, Best, Titus, Broyles, Sims...Injuries have hurt his results. I know, they were damaged. Guess what? Most player playing big time college football are damaged in some aspect.
The question about getting rid of Suh. I like Suh and think he got a bad rap, which he brought to himself. The bottom line is you can't build an elite team with three elite players...Calvin, Stafford and Suh...See Ya Suh! Send him to the AFC out West.
Schwartzs and Mayhew have one year...
Boar...on this post I'm not sure I agree with you. I think that the close losses ARE the fault of the coaches and the glaring holes on both sides of the ball (particularly interior OL and DBs) are Mayhews fault. This team hasn't quit but if that is the bar for whether a coach is deserving of some praise, Marinelli deserved some praise! I think Linehan is a horrendous OC. His offense is close to the top but really mainly becuase CJ is amazing and they pass a league most # of times. When the chips are down and the defense is focused Linehan can't coach his way out of a paperbag. My 13 year old daughter has probably predicted his play over 70% of the time.
Cunningham is very average and whoever is calling for the passive/prevent when they have the lead is an absolutely moron. Again I say it...how in the world do coaches keep their jobs when they call plays for the weakness of their team in crunch time? Linehan runs the ball...clearly a weakness of the offense...in crunch time. Cunningham puts pressure on his coverage units (some of the worst in the league for back seven coverage) in crunch time. Really???
The coaches deserve absolutely NOTHING. They will get another year and that's probably the right choice but not because they have earned anything at all.
Finally on Suh...I think it would be classic Millen/Mayhew move to get rid of Suh. How boneheaded would that be to take an immature kid with that elite talent and get rid of him just as he starts hitting the age when players grow up (if they grow up). YOu re-sign Suh as soon as possible and then you coach him. If he gets to 28 or 29 and he still costs you games with boneheaded mistakes then you ship him out as soon as possible.
Bottom line...with so few players with elite talent on this team...particularly on the defense...you don't get rid of one when you have one!
meiden- Undrafted
- Posts : 293
Join date : 2012-02-13
Re: The Titus debacle - place the fault squarely with Mayhew
by Dawildboar Wed Dec 05, 2012 7:09 pm
meiden wrote:Finally on Suh...I think it would be classic Millen/Mayhew move to get rid of Suh. How boneheaded would that be to take an immature kid with that elite talent and get rid of him just as he starts hitting the age when players grow up (if they grow up). YOu re-sign Suh as soon as possible and then you coach him. If he gets to 28 or 29 and he still costs you games with boneheaded mistakes then you ship him out as soon as possible.
Bottom line...with so few players with elite talent on this team...particularly on the defense...you don't get rid of one when you have one!
Mi, I don't want the team to get rid of Suh and I don't think they will...until 2014. I don't think they will be able to afford him, along with Stafford and CJ. Trade him and get something for him in his last year.
Dawildboar- Posts : 124
Join date : 2012-02-02
Location : Millersville, MD
Re: The Titus debacle - place the fault squarely with Mayhew
by SharBar57 Thu Dec 06, 2012 8:30 am
Mi, I don't want the team to get rid of Suh and I don't think they will...until 2014. I don't think they will be able to afford him, along with Stafford and CJ. Trade him and get something for him in his last year. [/quote]
My feelings exactly, Boar. I know they can't trade him until 2014...they will have to put up with his ego and antics until he does grow up, which some of these prima donas never seem to do! Get what you can from a trade and move on. This team as it is now is going no where fast. Two very high priced super stars and one, (Stafford) that is a rising star; but three stars do not make a good team. They have to start all over imo and I would hope with the defensive back seven.
Sharon
My feelings exactly, Boar. I know they can't trade him until 2014...they will have to put up with his ego and antics until he does grow up, which some of these prima donas never seem to do! Get what you can from a trade and move on. This team as it is now is going no where fast. Two very high priced super stars and one, (Stafford) that is a rising star; but three stars do not make a good team. They have to start all over imo and I would hope with the defensive back seven.
Sharon
SharBar57- Posts : 151
Join date : 2012-02-12
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