Aaron gets it...

by Guest Tue Jun 24, 2014 12:28 pm

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Posted by Mike Florio on June 24, 2014, 10:04 AM EDT
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AP

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Nine years ago, the Packers used a first-round pick on quarterback [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] because Brett Favre already was nearly three years into his will-I-or-won’t-I-retire routine.
For the next three years, Rodgers sat the bench behind Favre, until the Packers pushed Favre early in the 2008 offseason to commit to whether he’d play that year, possibly (probably) knowing that the answer at that time would be no.
It was indeed no, even though he later changed it to yes. By then, the Packers were all in with Rodgers, who was entering his fourth NFL season.
At the time, sitting a first-round rookie quarterback was the rule, not the exception. Starting the same year Rodgers became the starter in Green Bay, the exception became the rule.
Rodgers thinks that, when a rookie quarterback is drafted by a bad team, the rule should revert to being the exception.
“Some of these guys who are going to bad teams are [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.],” Rodgers tells Dan Pompei of Sports on Earth. “It’s hard to do that. I’ve seen a couple guys able to do it. [Ben] Roethlisberger was able to do it. He had a team kind of around him. [Joe] Flacco had some success early but he had a team kind of in place. You go to a place that has some pieces and you can have some success early. But if you go to a team that doesn’t have the pieces . . . it can really mess with your confidence.”
In a roundabout way, Rodgers essentially labels the teams that selected quarterbacks in the first round as not very good. Including one he plays twice per year.
“When you see other quarterbacks who might have to play quickly like [Teddy] Bridgewater potentially in Minnesota and Johnny [Manziel] in Cleveland, who knows if their teams are ready enough to complement their skills?” Rodgers said, adding that what the Jaguars are doing with [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] “has a lot of merit,” presumably because the Jaguars otherwise don’t.
There’s a potential benefit to sitting and waiting. Each year at the front of the career that the quarterback doesn’t play could become another year on the back end where he can.
“I do feel younger because of it,” Rodger said. “I think it extended my career.”
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by milani Tue Jun 24, 2014 6:27 pm

Alex Smith comes to mind.

by ILvLamp Tue Jun 24, 2014 8:27 pm

In Rodgers' case it may be true--he's fragile and clearly has identity issues/insecurities. I predict that will be his downfall down the road--it already began to show near the end of last season. Bridgewater appears to be more mentally tough than him--could be because his past experiences presented more challenges. Oooooooooo, I can't wait for MB/JnC to pounce on this one!

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by MB20 Tue Jun 24, 2014 8:52 pm

ILvLamp wrote:In Rodgers' case it may be true--he's fragile and clearly has identity issues/insecurities. I predict that will be his downfall down the road--it already began to show near the end of last season. Bridgewater appears to be more mentally tough than him--could be because his past experiences presented more challenges. Oooooooooo, I can't wait for MB/JnC to pounce on this one!

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Meh.... after 2009-2010, whatever remaining effect your trolling still had on me vanished forever.

Rodgers is speaking through the lens of his own experience, which is pretty normal. And, the QB who can step in and do it right away is a rarity, so it's not like his experience is the exception.

by JnC4GB Tue Jun 24, 2014 11:57 pm

Y'know what's really nice about having Rodgers as our QB? His play makes it pretty unnecessary to defend him. Unlike Favre, who's play routinely opened the door to criticism.

Downside is that I feel less passionate about Mister Clean Sheet Rodgers than I did the ol' Gunslinger.

It's a change I can live with Cool

by Guest Wed Jun 25, 2014 12:35 am

MB20 wrote:
ILvLamp wrote:In Rodgers' case it may be true--he's fragile and clearly has identity issues/insecurities. I predict that will be his downfall down the road--it already began to show near the end of last season. Bridgewater appears to be more mentally tough than him--could be because his past experiences presented more challenges. Oooooooooo, I can't wait for MB/JnC to pounce on this one!

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
Meh.... after 2009-2010, whatever remaining effect your trolling still had on me vanished forever.

Rodgers is speaking through the lens of his own experience, which is pretty normal. And, the QB who can step in and do it right away is a rarity, so it's not like his experience is the exception.

It really isn't that difficult. Every year there are your highly-touted *franchise* QB's who are paraded out by desperate, losing organizations to bolster fan support and put butts in seats--and every year the vast majority of them FAIL. The alarming part is that many wouldn't have needed to fail if handled properly to their development cycle. As MB points out--the exception IS the exception...and most often they are from the ranks of the Tom Brady's and Russell Wilson's who no one really ever expected anything much from. Identity issues have nothing to do with it. Most of these failed fucks like Brady Quinn, etc have never suffered from anything beyond being placed in a situation where no one man can prevail over being strapped to the collective weight of an organizational sandbag intent on continuing to rest on the bottom--and as they dig and dig and dig to succeed under the burden of the *savior franchise QB* expectations--they blow a seal in what they forevermore believe they can achieve--and that's when it's all over. Reclamations are possible--but you need to be good, very good...and the NFL hardly draws the brightest/best to the coaching ranks.

That rookie 1st round QB isn't truly ripe until that motherfucker is ready to take you and try to tear out your fucking windpipe when he yet again hears--not yet... Maybe Teddy will be the rare exception--what have their been? Three-Five in the past ten years? But I'll guarantee failure if they march him out there merely labeled as such--without actually PROVING/JUSTIFYING it.

by Guest Wed Jun 25, 2014 12:47 am

milani wrote:Alex Smith comes to mind.

Alex Smith is a marvel when you consider the typical NFL QB. The roadblocks and burdens that mofo proved to endure while still retaining his constitution is most rare in an NFL QB. Most are pampered little pricks all the way through and find their first real challenges in life when they reach the NFL...and that's why the outcome for most is so easily predicted. Like Ron Wolf clued a long time ago--1st round or 7th--they're ALL a fucking crap shoot because what they are embarking upon is so unlike anything they've ever encountered...and it takes a keen eye indeed to look inside the pupil and see if what is there is what is needed to prevail...

by ILvLamp Wed Jun 25, 2014 7:14 am

_HD_ wrote:
MB20 wrote:
ILvLamp wrote:In Rodgers' case it may be true--he's fragile and clearly has identity issues/insecurities. I predict that will be his downfall down the road--it already began to show near the end of last season. Bridgewater appears to be more mentally tough than him--could be because his past experiences presented more challenges. Oooooooooo, I can't wait for MB/JnC to pounce on this one!

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
Meh.... after 2009-2010, whatever remaining effect your trolling still had on me vanished forever.

Rodgers is speaking through the lens of his own experience, which is pretty normal. And, the QB who can step in and do it right away is a rarity, so it's not like his experience is the exception.

It really isn't that difficult. Every year there are your highly-touted *franchise* QB's who are paraded out by desperate, losing organizations to bolster fan support and put butts in seats--and every year the vast majority of them FAIL. The alarming part is that many wouldn't have needed to fail if handled properly to their development cycle. As MB points out--the exception IS the exception...and most often they are from the ranks of the Tom Brady's and Russell Wilson's who no one really ever expected anything much from. Identity issues have nothing to do with it. Most of these failed fucks like Brady Quinn, etc have never suffered from anything beyond being placed in a situation where no one man can prevail over being strapped to the collective weight of an organizational sandbag intent on continuing to rest on the bottom--and as they dig and dig and dig to succeed under the burden of the *savior franchise QB* expectations--they blow a seal in what they forevermore believe they can achieve--and that's when it's all over. Reclamations are possible--but you need to be good, very good...and the NFL hardly draws the brightest/best to the coaching ranks.

That rookie 1st round QB isn't truly ripe until that motherfucker is ready to take you and try to tear out your fucking windpipe when he yet again hears--not yet... Maybe Teddy will be the rare exception--what have their been? Three-Five in the past ten years? But I'll guarantee failure if they march him out there merely labeled as such--without actually PROVING/JUSTIFYING it.

I have a question for you, MB and HD. If you are interviewing someone for a leadership position, and you asked when they would like to start, which answer would you like best:

-I'd like to wait a few years to learn the position due to confidence issues
-I'd like to start now

by MB20 Wed Jun 25, 2014 9:10 am

ILvLamp wrote:
_HD_ wrote:
MB20 wrote:
ILvLamp wrote:In Rodgers' case it may be true--he's fragile and clearly has identity issues/insecurities. I predict that will be his downfall down the road--it already began to show near the end of last season. Bridgewater appears to be more mentally tough than him--could be because his past experiences presented more challenges. Oooooooooo, I can't wait for MB/JnC to pounce on this one!

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
Meh.... after 2009-2010, whatever remaining effect your trolling still had on me vanished forever.

Rodgers is speaking through the lens of his own experience, which is pretty normal. And, the QB who can step in and do it right away is a rarity, so it's not like his experience is the exception.

It really isn't that difficult. Every year there are your highly-touted *franchise* QB's who are paraded out by desperate, losing organizations to bolster fan support and put butts in seats--and every year the vast majority of them FAIL. The alarming part is that many wouldn't have needed to fail if handled properly to their development cycle. As MB points out--the exception IS the exception...and most often they are from the ranks of the Tom Brady's and Russell Wilson's who no one really ever expected anything much from. Identity issues have nothing to do with it. Most of these failed fucks like Brady Quinn, etc have never suffered from anything beyond being placed in a situation where no one man can prevail over being strapped to the collective weight of an organizational sandbag intent on continuing to rest on the bottom--and as they dig and dig and dig to succeed under the burden of the *savior franchise QB* expectations--they blow a seal in what they forevermore believe they can achieve--and that's when it's all over. Reclamations are possible--but you need to be good, very good...and the NFL hardly draws the brightest/best to the coaching ranks.

That rookie 1st round QB isn't truly ripe until that motherfucker is ready to take you and try to tear out your fucking windpipe when he yet again hears--not yet... Maybe Teddy will be the rare exception--what have their been? Three-Five in the past ten years? But I'll guarantee failure if they march him out there merely labeled as such--without actually PROVING/JUSTIFYING it.

I have a question for you, MB and HD. If you are interviewing someone for a leadership position, and you asked when they would like to start, which answer would you like best:

-I'd like to wait a few years to learn the position due to confidence issues
-I'd like to start now

I get the premise of your question, but I don't think there is any job situation that is an apples-to-apples comparison to being drafted as an NFL quarterback. If I were interviewing someone in Corporate America for a leadership position, it would be understood that the person would be ready to step in and do the job from Day One- otherwise, s/he would have been circular-filed long before they got to my office. For a QB, "I'd like to start now" is great, but unless his play grabbed me by the collar and said, "No, Coach, I meant I'd like to start right fucking NOW," it wouldn't matter. I don't think any first-round QB would ever admit to needing a few years to learn the position. But a lot of them don't know what they don't know before their rookie seasons, either.

by JnC4GB Wed Jun 25, 2014 9:26 am

MB20 wrote:
ILvLamp wrote:
I have a question for you, MB and HD. If you are interviewing someone for a leadership position, and you asked when they would like to start, which answer would you like best:

-I'd like to wait a few years to learn the position due to confidence issues
-I'd like to start now

I get the premise of your question, but I don't think there is any job situation that is an apples-to-apples comparison to being drafted as an NFL quarterback.

A thousand times THIS cheers

by Guest Wed Jun 25, 2014 12:37 pm

ILvLamp wrote:
_HD_ wrote:
MB20 wrote:
ILvLamp wrote:In Rodgers' case it may be true--he's fragile and clearly has identity issues/insecurities. I predict that will be his downfall down the road--it already began to show near the end of last season. Bridgewater appears to be more mentally tough than him--could be because his past experiences presented more challenges. Oooooooooo, I can't wait for MB/JnC to pounce on this one!

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
Meh.... after 2009-2010, whatever remaining effect your trolling still had on me vanished forever.

Rodgers is speaking through the lens of his own experience, which is pretty normal. And, the QB who can step in and do it right away is a rarity, so it's not like his experience is the exception.

It really isn't that difficult. Every year there are your highly-touted *franchise* QB's who are paraded out by desperate, losing organizations to bolster fan support and put butts in seats--and every year the vast majority of them FAIL. The alarming part is that many wouldn't have needed to fail if handled properly to their development cycle. As MB points out--the exception IS the exception...and most often they are from the ranks of the Tom Brady's and Russell Wilson's who no one really ever expected anything much from. Identity issues have nothing to do with it. Most of these failed fucks like Brady Quinn, etc have never suffered from anything beyond being placed in a situation where no one man can prevail over being strapped to the collective weight of an organizational sandbag intent on continuing to rest on the bottom--and as they dig and dig and dig to succeed under the burden of the *savior franchise QB* expectations--they blow a seal in what they forevermore believe they can achieve--and that's when it's all over. Reclamations are possible--but you need to be good, very good...and the NFL hardly draws the brightest/best to the coaching ranks.

That rookie 1st round QB isn't truly ripe until that motherfucker is ready to take you and try to tear out your fucking windpipe when he yet again hears--not yet... Maybe Teddy will be the rare exception--what have their been? Three-Five in the past ten years? But I'll guarantee failure if they march him out there merely labeled as such--without actually PROVING/JUSTIFYING it.

I have a question for you, MB and HD. If you are interviewing someone for a leadership position, and you asked when they would like to start, which answer would you like best:

-I'd like to wait a few years to learn the position due to confidence issues
-I'd like to start now

That's a very good question, Coach. I'm glad you asked it because it gets right to the heart of why I'm here. What I'm going to do is--just simply go out there and work my tail off in everything I do--in practice, in camp, in team meetings and the weight room...and when I'm not doing that--you'll find me buried in the playbook. Talk is cheap. You won't find me doing a whole lot of that other than asking a whole lot of questions. What I'm going to do is quite simply whatever it takes to SHOW YOU through my play and preparation when I'd like to start--and put you in a position where it's an easy call for you to make. When will that be? That will be when you say it will be--but I'm shooting for yesterday...

The above is what I want to hear--but the point is--sound isn't the sense that should be in play here. SIGHT is. Anybody can flap their gums. Talkin' it and walkin' it are two very different things. For me as Coach--the big bad wolf doesn't see the field with the 1's until he huffs and he puffs and he proves to have reached down deep enough to grasp onto what he needs to blow down the brick shit house... Then, and only then, do I know he's ready to prevail over the shit storm he's going to face in there...

by duck Wed Jun 25, 2014 1:08 pm

JnC4GB wrote:
MB20 wrote:
ILvLamp wrote:
I have a question for you, MB and HD. If you are interviewing someone for a leadership position, and you asked when they would like to start, which answer would you like best:

-I'd like to wait a few years to learn the position due to confidence issues
-I'd like to start now

I get the premise of your question, but I don't think there is any job situation that is an apples-to-apples comparison to being drafted as an NFL quarterback.

A thousand times THIS

Add another thousand.

by ILvLamp Wed Jun 25, 2014 6:02 pm

MB20 wrote:
ILvLamp wrote:
_HD_ wrote:
MB20 wrote:
ILvLamp wrote:In Rodgers' case it may be true--he's fragile and clearly has identity issues/insecurities. I predict that will be his downfall down the road--it already began to show near the end of last season. Bridgewater appears to be more mentally tough than him--could be because his past experiences presented more challenges. Oooooooooo, I can't wait for MB/JnC to pounce on this one!

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
Meh.... after 2009-2010, whatever remaining effect your trolling still had on me vanished forever.

Rodgers is speaking through the lens of his own experience, which is pretty normal. And, the QB who can step in and do it right away is a rarity, so it's not like his experience is the exception.

It really isn't that difficult. Every year there are your highly-touted *franchise* QB's who are paraded out by desperate, losing organizations to bolster fan support and put butts in seats--and every year the vast majority of them FAIL. The alarming part is that many wouldn't have needed to fail if handled properly to their development cycle. As MB points out--the exception IS the exception...and most often they are from the ranks of the Tom Brady's and Russell Wilson's who no one really ever expected anything much from. Identity issues have nothing to do with it. Most of these failed fucks like Brady Quinn, etc have never suffered from anything beyond being placed in a situation where no one man can prevail over being strapped to the collective weight of an organizational sandbag intent on continuing to rest on the bottom--and as they dig and dig and dig to succeed under the burden of the *savior franchise QB* expectations--they blow a seal in what they forevermore believe they can achieve--and that's when it's all over. Reclamations are possible--but you need to be good, very good...and the NFL hardly draws the brightest/best to the coaching ranks.

That rookie 1st round QB isn't truly ripe until that motherfucker is ready to take you and try to tear out your fucking windpipe when he yet again hears--not yet... Maybe Teddy will be the rare exception--what have their been? Three-Five in the past ten years? But I'll guarantee failure if they march him out there merely labeled as such--without actually PROVING/JUSTIFYING it.

I have a question for you, MB and HD. If you are interviewing someone for a leadership position, and you asked when they would like to start, which answer would you like best:

-I'd like to wait a few years to learn the position due to confidence issues
-I'd like to start now
I get the premise of your question, but I don't think there is any job situation that is an apples-to-apples comparison to being drafted as an NFL quarterback. If I were interviewing someone in Corporate America for a leadership position, it would be understood that the person would be ready to step in and do the job from Day One- otherwise, s/he would have been circular-filed long before they got to my office. For a QB, "I'd like to start now" is great, but unless his play grabbed me by the collar and said, "No, Coach, I meant I'd like to start right fucking NOW," it wouldn't matter. I don't think any first-round QB would ever admit to needing a few years to learn the position. But a lot of them don't know what they don't know before their rookie seasons, either.

Corporate America or NFL quarterback, it all comes down to confidence (and I'm not talking about "arrogance"), which is one of the main ingredients needed in a leadership role anywhere. I would want my quarterback ready and willing to start regardless of whether or not there is a safety net of skilled players surrounding him. That shouldn't be his concern. Rodgers' statements indicate several red flags to me in relation to his leadership qualities. He sounds more concerned about how he is going to look, rather than what he can learn along the way and teach his team. To be a leader, you have to be able to experience humility if you make mistakes and model how to work through it and remain strong.

by ILvLamp Wed Jun 25, 2014 6:07 pm

_HD_ wrote:
ILvLamp wrote:
_HD_ wrote:
MB20 wrote:
ILvLamp wrote:In Rodgers' case it may be true--he's fragile and clearly has identity issues/insecurities. I predict that will be his downfall down the road--it already began to show near the end of last season. Bridgewater appears to be more mentally tough than him--could be because his past experiences presented more challenges. Oooooooooo, I can't wait for MB/JnC to pounce on this one!

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
Meh.... after 2009-2010, whatever remaining effect your trolling still had on me vanished forever.

Rodgers is speaking through the lens of his own experience, which is pretty normal. And, the QB who can step in and do it right away is a rarity, so it's not like his experience is the exception.

It really isn't that difficult. Every year there are your highly-touted *franchise* QB's who are paraded out by desperate, losing organizations to bolster fan support and put butts in seats--and every year the vast majority of them FAIL. The alarming part is that many wouldn't have needed to fail if handled properly to their development cycle. As MB points out--the exception IS the exception...and most often they are from the ranks of the Tom Brady's and Russell Wilson's who no one really ever expected anything much from. Identity issues have nothing to do with it. Most of these failed fucks like Brady Quinn, etc have never suffered from anything beyond being placed in a situation where no one man can prevail over being strapped to the collective weight of an organizational sandbag intent on continuing to rest on the bottom--and as they dig and dig and dig to succeed under the burden of the *savior franchise QB* expectations--they blow a seal in what they forevermore believe they can achieve--and that's when it's all over. Reclamations are possible--but you need to be good, very good...and the NFL hardly draws the brightest/best to the coaching ranks.

That rookie 1st round QB isn't truly ripe until that motherfucker is ready to take you and try to tear out your fucking windpipe when he yet again hears--not yet... Maybe Teddy will be the rare exception--what have their been? Three-Five in the past ten years? But I'll guarantee failure if they march him out there merely labeled as such--without actually PROVING/JUSTIFYING it.

I have a question for you, MB and HD. If you are interviewing someone for a leadership position, and you asked when they would like to start, which answer would you like best:

-I'd like to wait a few years to learn the position due to confidence issues
-I'd like to start now

That's a very good question, Coach. I'm glad you asked it because it gets right to the heart of why I'm here. What I'm going to do is--just simply go out there and work my tail off in everything I do--in practice, in camp, in team meetings and the weight room...and when I'm not doing that--you'll find me buried in the playbook. Talk is cheap. You won't find me doing a whole lot of that other than asking a whole lot of questions. What I'm going to do is quite simply whatever it takes to SHOW YOU through my play and preparation when I'd like to start--and put you in a position where it's an easy call for you to make. When will that be? That will be when you say it will be--but I'm shooting for yesterday...

The above is what I want to hear--but the point is--sound isn't the sense that should be in play here. SIGHT is. Anybody can flap their gums. Talkin' it and walkin' it are two very different things. For me as Coach--the big bad wolf doesn't see the field with the 1's until he huffs and he puffs and he proves to have reached down deep enough to grasp onto what he needs to blow down the brick shit house... Then, and only then, do I know he's ready to prevail over the shit storm he's going to face in there...

I could live with that response if I were the coach. It doesn't really differ from what I stated earlier about Teddy B starting. If he doesn't SHOW that he's better than Cassel in camp, I wouldn't want him to start, and if the coaches are as good as advertised, they wouldn't either. So far, it appears that Teddy is doing exactly everything that you stated above. This is why he should start if he continues this level of performance through camp.

by MB20 Wed Jun 25, 2014 10:02 pm

ILvLamp wrote:
MB20 wrote:
ILvLamp wrote:
_HD_ wrote:
MB20 wrote:
ILvLamp wrote:In Rodgers' case it may be true--he's fragile and clearly has identity issues/insecurities. I predict that will be his downfall down the road--it already began to show near the end of last season. Bridgewater appears to be more mentally tough than him--could be because his past experiences presented more challenges. Oooooooooo, I can't wait for MB/JnC to pounce on this one!

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
Meh.... after 2009-2010, whatever remaining effect your trolling still had on me vanished forever.

Rodgers is speaking through the lens of his own experience, which is pretty normal. And, the QB who can step in and do it right away is a rarity, so it's not like his experience is the exception.

It really isn't that difficult. Every year there are your highly-touted *franchise* QB's who are paraded out by desperate, losing organizations to bolster fan support and put butts in seats--and every year the vast majority of them FAIL. The alarming part is that many wouldn't have needed to fail if handled properly to their development cycle. As MB points out--the exception IS the exception...and most often they are from the ranks of the Tom Brady's and Russell Wilson's who no one really ever expected anything much from. Identity issues have nothing to do with it. Most of these failed fucks like Brady Quinn, etc have never suffered from anything beyond being placed in a situation where no one man can prevail over being strapped to the collective weight of an organizational sandbag intent on continuing to rest on the bottom--and as they dig and dig and dig to succeed under the burden of the *savior franchise QB* expectations--they blow a seal in what they forevermore believe they can achieve--and that's when it's all over. Reclamations are possible--but you need to be good, very good...and the NFL hardly draws the brightest/best to the coaching ranks.

That rookie 1st round QB isn't truly ripe until that motherfucker is ready to take you and try to tear out your fucking windpipe when he yet again hears--not yet... Maybe Teddy will be the rare exception--what have their been? Three-Five in the past ten years? But I'll guarantee failure if they march him out there merely labeled as such--without actually PROVING/JUSTIFYING it.

I have a question for you, MB and HD. If you are interviewing someone for a leadership position, and you asked when they would like to start, which answer would you like best:

-I'd like to wait a few years to learn the position due to confidence issues
-I'd like to start now
I get the premise of your question, but I don't think there is any job situation that is an apples-to-apples comparison to being drafted as an NFL quarterback. If I were interviewing someone in Corporate America for a leadership position, it would be understood that the person would be ready to step in and do the job from Day One- otherwise, s/he would have been circular-filed long before they got to my office. For a QB, "I'd like to start now" is great, but unless his play grabbed me by the collar and said, "No, Coach, I meant I'd like to start right fucking NOW," it wouldn't matter. I don't think any first-round QB would ever admit to needing a few years to learn the position. But a lot of them don't know what they don't know before their rookie seasons, either.

Corporate America or NFL quarterback, it all comes down to confidence (and I'm not talking about "arrogance"), which is one of the main ingredients needed in a leadership role anywhere. I would want my quarterback ready and willing to start regardless of whether or not there is a safety net of skilled players surrounding him. That shouldn't be his concern. Rodgers' statements indicate several red flags to me in relation to his leadership qualities. He sounds more concerned about how he is going to look, rather than what he can learn along the way and teach his team. To be a leader, you have to be able to experience humility if you make mistakes and model how to work through it and remain strong.

I think you're wish-casting hard wrt Rodgers and Teddy. The entire beginning of Rodgers' career was about him learning, experiencing adversity, and growing through it. He seems a bit insecure to me, too, but it certainly hasn't been a detriment to him becoming the best QB in the game. To call his leadership into question is laughable IMO.

Like I said about Teddy- don't TELL me you're ready to start. SHOW me you're ready to start. As a coach, the bar I'd set for being satisfied that he's ready would be really, really high. And confidence isn't enough. You need to be confident, get it, and be able to execute when live bullets are flying. It would take an awful, awful lot for a late first-rounder to show me that he meets all those criteria. It would take an awful lot for an EARLY first-rounder to show me all that.

by ILvLamp Wed Jun 25, 2014 10:32 pm

MB20 wrote:
ILvLamp wrote:
MB20 wrote:
ILvLamp wrote:
_HD_ wrote:
MB20 wrote:
ILvLamp wrote:In Rodgers' case it may be true--he's fragile and clearly has identity issues/insecurities. I predict that will be his downfall down the road--it already began to show near the end of last season. Bridgewater appears to be more mentally tough than him--could be because his past experiences presented more challenges. Oooooooooo, I can't wait for MB/JnC to pounce on this one!

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
Meh.... after 2009-2010, whatever remaining effect your trolling still had on me vanished forever.

Rodgers is speaking through the lens of his own experience, which is pretty normal. And, the QB who can step in and do it right away is a rarity, so it's not like his experience is the exception.

It really isn't that difficult. Every year there are your highly-touted *franchise* QB's who are paraded out by desperate, losing organizations to bolster fan support and put butts in seats--and every year the vast majority of them FAIL. The alarming part is that many wouldn't have needed to fail if handled properly to their development cycle. As MB points out--the exception IS the exception...and most often they are from the ranks of the Tom Brady's and Russell Wilson's who no one really ever expected anything much from. Identity issues have nothing to do with it. Most of these failed fucks like Brady Quinn, etc have never suffered from anything beyond being placed in a situation where no one man can prevail over being strapped to the collective weight of an organizational sandbag intent on continuing to rest on the bottom--and as they dig and dig and dig to succeed under the burden of the *savior franchise QB* expectations--they blow a seal in what they forevermore believe they can achieve--and that's when it's all over. Reclamations are possible--but you need to be good, very good...and the NFL hardly draws the brightest/best to the coaching ranks.

That rookie 1st round QB isn't truly ripe until that motherfucker is ready to take you and try to tear out your fucking windpipe when he yet again hears--not yet... Maybe Teddy will be the rare exception--what have their been? Three-Five in the past ten years? But I'll guarantee failure if they march him out there merely labeled as such--without actually PROVING/JUSTIFYING it.

I have a question for you, MB and HD. If you are interviewing someone for a leadership position, and you asked when they would like to start, which answer would you like best:

-I'd like to wait a few years to learn the position due to confidence issues
-I'd like to start now
I get the premise of your question, but I don't think there is any job situation that is an apples-to-apples comparison to being drafted as an NFL quarterback. If I were interviewing someone in Corporate America for a leadership position, it would be understood that the person would be ready to step in and do the job from Day One- otherwise, s/he would have been circular-filed long before they got to my office. For a QB, "I'd like to start now" is great, but unless his play grabbed me by the collar and said, "No, Coach, I meant I'd like to start right fucking NOW," it wouldn't matter. I don't think any first-round QB would ever admit to needing a few years to learn the position. But a lot of them don't know what they don't know before their rookie seasons, either.

Corporate America or NFL quarterback, it all comes down to confidence (and I'm not talking about "arrogance"), which is one of the main ingredients needed in a leadership role anywhere. I would want my quarterback ready and willing to start regardless of whether or not there is a safety net of skilled players surrounding him. That shouldn't be his concern. Rodgers' statements indicate several red flags to me in relation to his leadership qualities. He sounds more concerned about how he is going to look, rather than what he can learn along the way and teach his team. To be a leader, you have to be able to experience humility if you make mistakes and model how to work through it and remain strong.
I think you're wish-casting hard wrt Rodgers and Teddy. The entire beginning of Rodgers' career was about him learning, experiencing adversity, and growing through it. He seems a bit insecure to me, too, but it certainly hasn't been a detriment to him becoming the best QB in the game. To call his leadership into question is laughable IMO.

Like I said about Teddy- don't TELL me you're ready to start. SHOW me you're ready to start. As a coach, the bar I'd set for being satisfied that he's ready would be really, really high. And confidence isn't enough. You need to be confident, get it, and be able to execute when live bullets are flying. It would take an awful, awful lot for a late first-rounder to show me that he meets all those criteria. It would take an awful lot for an EARLY first-rounder to show me all that.

Actually, his own teammates have questioned his leadership skills, but I was referring to his statements in the article. As for Teddy "telling or showing," I have repeated over and over that he should only start if he shows that he's ready, which he has been demonstrating to date. We shall see how he finishes camp/preseason, but I like what I'm seeing so far. Is it wish-casting with my opinions on Rodgers and Teddy? I'm sure there's some bias in there--I don't deny that I'm a homer (not to the roofer level--more to the Duck level), but I can also put two and two together from what I see. That's how I see it--we'll see who is right/wrong when the season unfolds. I have no problem admitting I was wrong if that's how it plays out--wouldn't be the first time. I also recall telling HD that T-Jack and Ponder were going to be good...sigh...

by MB20 Wed Jun 25, 2014 11:04 pm

ILvLamp wrote:
MB20 wrote:
ILvLamp wrote:
MB20 wrote:
ILvLamp wrote:
_HD_ wrote:
MB20 wrote:
ILvLamp wrote:In Rodgers' case it may be true--he's fragile and clearly has identity issues/insecurities. I predict that will be his downfall down the road--it already began to show near the end of last season. Bridgewater appears to be more mentally tough than him--could be because his past experiences presented more challenges. Oooooooooo, I can't wait for MB/JnC to pounce on this one!

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Meh.... after 2009-2010, whatever remaining effect your trolling still had on me vanished forever.

Rodgers is speaking through the lens of his own experience, which is pretty normal. And, the QB who can step in and do it right away is a rarity, so it's not like his experience is the exception.

It really isn't that difficult. Every year there are your highly-touted *franchise* QB's who are paraded out by desperate, losing organizations to bolster fan support and put butts in seats--and every year the vast majority of them FAIL. The alarming part is that many wouldn't have needed to fail if handled properly to their development cycle. As MB points out--the exception IS the exception...and most often they are from the ranks of the Tom Brady's and Russell Wilson's who no one really ever expected anything much from. Identity issues have nothing to do with it. Most of these failed fucks like Brady Quinn, etc have never suffered from anything beyond being placed in a situation where no one man can prevail over being strapped to the collective weight of an organizational sandbag intent on continuing to rest on the bottom--and as they dig and dig and dig to succeed under the burden of the *savior franchise QB* expectations--they blow a seal in what they forevermore believe they can achieve--and that's when it's all over. Reclamations are possible--but you need to be good, very good...and the NFL hardly draws the brightest/best to the coaching ranks.

That rookie 1st round QB isn't truly ripe until that motherfucker is ready to take you and try to tear out your fucking windpipe when he yet again hears--not yet... Maybe Teddy will be the rare exception--what have their been? Three-Five in the past ten years? But I'll guarantee failure if they march him out there merely labeled as such--without actually PROVING/JUSTIFYING it.

I have a question for you, MB and HD. If you are interviewing someone for a leadership position, and you asked when they would like to start, which answer would you like best:

-I'd like to wait a few years to learn the position due to confidence issues
-I'd like to start now
I get the premise of your question, but I don't think there is any job situation that is an apples-to-apples comparison to being drafted as an NFL quarterback. If I were interviewing someone in Corporate America for a leadership position, it would be understood that the person would be ready to step in and do the job from Day One- otherwise, s/he would have been circular-filed long before they got to my office. For a QB, "I'd like to start now" is great, but unless his play grabbed me by the collar and said, "No, Coach, I meant I'd like to start right fucking NOW," it wouldn't matter. I don't think any first-round QB would ever admit to needing a few years to learn the position. But a lot of them don't know what they don't know before their rookie seasons, either.

Corporate America or NFL quarterback, it all comes down to confidence (and I'm not talking about "arrogance"), which is one of the main ingredients needed in a leadership role anywhere. I would want my quarterback ready and willing to start regardless of whether or not there is a safety net of skilled players surrounding him. That shouldn't be his concern. Rodgers' statements indicate several red flags to me in relation to his leadership qualities. He sounds more concerned about how he is going to look, rather than what he can learn along the way and teach his team. To be a leader, you have to be able to experience humility if you make mistakes and model how to work through it and remain strong.
I think you're wish-casting hard wrt Rodgers and Teddy. The entire beginning of Rodgers' career was about him learning, experiencing adversity, and growing through it. He seems a bit insecure to me, too, but it certainly hasn't been a detriment to him becoming the best QB in the game. To call his leadership into question is laughable IMO.

Like I said about Teddy- don't TELL me you're ready to start. SHOW me you're ready to start. As a coach, the bar I'd set for being satisfied that he's ready would be really, really high. And confidence isn't enough. You need to be confident, get it, and be able to execute when live bullets are flying. It would take an awful, awful lot for a late first-rounder to show me that he meets all those criteria. It would take an awful lot for an EARLY first-rounder to show me all that.

Actually, his own teammates have questioned his leadership skills, but I was referring to his statements in the article. As for Teddy "telling or showing," I have repeated over and over that he should only start if he shows that he's ready, which he has been demonstrating to date. We shall see how he finishes camp/preseason, but I like what I'm seeing so far. Is it wish-casting with my opinions on Rodgers and Teddy? I'm sure there's some bias in there--I don't deny that I'm a homer (not to the roofer level--more to the Duck level), but I can also put two and two together from what I see. That's how I see it--we'll see who is right/wrong when the season unfolds. I have no problem admitting I was wrong if that's how it plays out--wouldn't be the first time. I also recall telling HD that T-Jack and Ponder were going to be good...sigh...

Haha... ain't it great? All any of this debate is really about is merely us trying to look like we knew which way the wind was blowing before anyone else did. I'm actually really intrigued by Bridgewater- handled properly, I think the kid has a real chance to be a good QB (which I never thought about Ponder even for a nanosecond- I actually felt, and still feel, that Spielman deserved to be fired largely because of that pick).

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