Give Whitey a lollipop...

_HD_ wrote:The official numbers for Rodgers' deal reached the NFLPA and, according to a source, the data shows that Rodgers received a $35 million signing bonus that is spread over the first five years of the contract. They lowered his base salary from $9.75 million to $4.5 million (plus $500,000 workout), so his cap number for 2013 is $12 million.

Since he was already counting $9.75 million against the cap, the Packers only lost $2.25 million of cap space.

As of Friday they were $15.48 million under the cap, so they are now $13.23 million under.

Rodgers' five-year extension came in at $110 million of new money as we reported here first on Friday.

What are the Packers going to do with all that cap space?

Well, at least $5 million will go to their 11 draft choices.

After that, they have the option of extending the contracts of NT B.J. Raji, CB Sam Shields, WR James Jones and anybody else they view as a priority. Or they have the option of carrying the salary cap space over to the 2014 season to help them deal with the increases they'll face on Rodgers' and LB Clay Matthews' deals.

The Packers were able to limit their cap responsibility this year by using a huge amount of cash to pay off Rodgers and Matthews.

Rodgers received a $35 million signing bonus and Matthews received $20.5 million. That means the Packers paid out $55.5 million to their two stars. That's not chump change, but when you made $42.7 million in profit last year and probably will make that or more this year, it's nothing that will bankrupt the organzation.

Rodgers' salary cap numbers are $12 milion in '13, $17.9 million in '14, $18.6 million in '15, $19.8 million in '16, $20.65 million in '17, $20.9 million in '18 and $21.1 million in '19.

This was actually artfully handled. The $17.9M in '14 onward will give them a sharp sting--but there is no bullshit balloon in this extension--so the Pack can readily bring down Rodgers' cap hit each year he looks to continue to be productive by dropping his salary and writing a roster bonus check to make up the difference--which can be prorated over the remaining life of the deal. Well done.

duck wrote:

_HD_ wrote:The official numbers for Rodgers' deal reached the NFLPA and, according to a source, the data shows that Rodgers received a $35 million signing bonus that is spread over the first five years of the contract. They lowered his base salary from $9.75 million to $4.5 million (plus $500,000 workout), so his cap number for 2013 is $12 million.

Since he was already counting $9.75 million against the cap, the Packers only lost $2.25 million of cap space.

As of Friday they were $15.48 million under the cap, so they are now $13.23 million under.

Rodgers' five-year extension came in at $110 million of new money as we reported here first on Friday.

What are the Packers going to do with all that cap space?

Well, at least $5 million will go to their 11 draft choices.

After that, they have the option of extending the contracts of NT B.J. Raji, CB Sam Shields, WR James Jones and anybody else they view as a priority. Or they have the option of carrying the salary cap space over to the 2014 season to help them deal with the increases they'll face on Rodgers' and LB Clay Matthews' deals.

The Packers were able to limit their cap responsibility this year by using a huge amount of cash to pay off Rodgers and Matthews.

Rodgers received a $35 million signing bonus and Matthews received $20.5 million. That means the Packers paid out $55.5 million to their two stars. That's not chump change, but when you made $42.7 million in profit last year and probably will make that or more this year, it's nothing that will bankrupt the organzation.

Rodgers' salary cap numbers are $12 milion in '13, $17.9 million in '14, $18.6 million in '15, $19.8 million in '16, $20.65 million in '17, $20.9 million in '18 and $21.1 million in '19.

This was actually artfully handled. The $17.9M in '14 onward will give them a sharp sting--but there is no bullshit balloon in this extension--so the Pack can readily bring down Rodgers' cap hit each year he looks to continue to be productive by dropping his salary and writing a roster bonus check to make up the difference--which can be prorated over the remaining life of the deal. Well done.

Not bad for a one trick pony, eh?

_HD_ wrote:

duck wrote:

_HD_ wrote:The official numbers for Rodgers' deal reached the NFLPA and, according to a source, the data shows that Rodgers received a $35 million signing bonus that is spread over the first five years of the contract. They lowered his base salary from $9.75 million to $4.5 million (plus $500,000 workout), so his cap number for 2013 is $12 million.

Since he was already counting $9.75 million against the cap, the Packers only lost $2.25 million of cap space.

As of Friday they were $15.48 million under the cap, so they are now $13.23 million under.

Rodgers' five-year extension came in at $110 million of new money as we reported here first on Friday.

What are the Packers going to do with all that cap space?

Well, at least $5 million will go to their 11 draft choices.

After that, they have the option of extending the contracts of NT B.J. Raji, CB Sam Shields, WR James Jones and anybody else they view as a priority. Or they have the option of carrying the salary cap space over to the 2014 season to help them deal with the increases they'll face on Rodgers' and LB Clay Matthews' deals.

The Packers were able to limit their cap responsibility this year by using a huge amount of cash to pay off Rodgers and Matthews.

Rodgers received a $35 million signing bonus and Matthews received $20.5 million. That means the Packers paid out $55.5 million to their two stars. That's not chump change, but when you made $42.7 million in profit last year and probably will make that or more this year, it's nothing that will bankrupt the organzation.

Rodgers' salary cap numbers are $12 milion in '13, $17.9 million in '14, $18.6 million in '15, $19.8 million in '16, $20.65 million in '17, $20.9 million in '18 and $21.1 million in '19.

This was actually artfully handled. The $17.9M in '14 onward will give them a sharp sting--but there is no bullshit balloon in this extension--so the Pack can readily bring down Rodgers' cap hit each year he looks to continue to be productive by dropping his salary and writing a roster bonus check to make up the difference--which can be prorated over the remaining life of the deal. Well done.

Not bad for a one trick pony, eh?

Yes--that and what looks to be a more typical Thompson draft certainly is a hopeful sign that he's he's starting to come out of the funk he's been in largely since the Pack won the SuperBowl. The jury is still out--but the last two drafts prior to this one have been mostly forgettable and free agency, of course, MIA... Add in the very poor roster/cap decisions on Driver, Jennings (Vikings saved his ass) etc and his less than diligent proaction in trimming underperforming contracts from the roster--and the B player has been no better than a C up until very recently. There's still no excuse for that O-line and the draft certainly provided no near term answers--and somebody needs to be shot if they start the regular season with a kicker like Crosby... Just too damn many games next year with a line of +/- 3 to have a kicker who you can't rely upon to put 3 up when you most need them...

duck wrote:

_HD_ wrote:

duck wrote:

_HD_ wrote:The official numbers for Rodgers' deal reached the NFLPA and, according to a source, the data shows that Rodgers received a $35 million signing bonus that is spread over the first five years of the contract. They lowered his base salary from $9.75 million to $4.5 million (plus $500,000 workout), so his cap number for 2013 is $12 million.

Since he was already counting $9.75 million against the cap, the Packers only lost $2.25 million of cap space.

As of Friday they were $15.48 million under the cap, so they are now $13.23 million under.

Rodgers' five-year extension came in at $110 million of new money as we reported here first on Friday.

What are the Packers going to do with all that cap space?

Well, at least $5 million will go to their 11 draft choices.

After that, they have the option of extending the contracts of NT B.J. Raji, CB Sam Shields, WR James Jones and anybody else they view as a priority. Or they have the option of carrying the salary cap space over to the 2014 season to help them deal with the increases they'll face on Rodgers' and LB Clay Matthews' deals.

The Packers were able to limit their cap responsibility this year by using a huge amount of cash to pay off Rodgers and Matthews.

Rodgers received a $35 million signing bonus and Matthews received $20.5 million. That means the Packers paid out $55.5 million to their two stars. That's not chump change, but when you made $42.7 million in profit last year and probably will make that or more this year, it's nothing that will bankrupt the organzation.

Rodgers' salary cap numbers are $12 milion in '13, $17.9 million in '14, $18.6 million in '15, $19.8 million in '16, $20.65 million in '17, $20.9 million in '18 and $21.1 million in '19.

This was actually artfully handled. The $17.9M in '14 onward will give them a sharp sting--but there is no bullshit balloon in this extension--so the Pack can readily bring down Rodgers' cap hit each year he looks to continue to be productive by dropping his salary and writing a roster bonus check to make up the difference--which can be prorated over the remaining life of the deal. Well done.

Not bad for a one trick pony, eh?

Yes--that and what looks to be a more typical Thompson draft certainly is a hopeful sign that he's he's starting to come out of the funk he's been in largely since the Pack won the SuperBowl. The jury is still out--but the last two drafts prior to this one have been mostly forgettable and free agency, of course, MIA... Add in the very poor roster/cap decisions on Driver, Jennings (Vikings saved his ass) etc and his less than diligent proaction in trimming underperforming contracts from the roster--and the B player has been no better than a C up until very recently. There's still no excuse for that O-line and the draft certainly provided no near term answers--and somebody needs to be shot if they start the regular season with a kicker like Crosby... Just too damn many games next year with a line of +/- 3 to have a kicker who you can't rely upon to put 3 up when you most need them...

Agreed with Driver and Jennings. Emphatically agreed with Crosby. The thought I've dreaded his entire career is him lining up for a 45-yard FG with the Packers' playoff fate on the line. After last year that thought has morphed into a wake-up-in-cold-sweat nightmare. I'd be much more comfortable with your average midget European soccer player.

I understand Thor pimps them out. $59.95--or just go wiith the six punch pass. PFKIA can serve as a reference--no doubt...

However, I think you've taken out that broad brush again, HD. I'm not whining about them because it's part of the game, but I really think much of Green Bay's slide from the top last year can be explained by injuries. Think of it, the last three number one picks (Perry, Sherrod and Bulaga) went down. Our O-line might not be so shaky if we had the latter two and frankly, it's a testament to our developmental program that Barclay was able to step in and contribute. Would I like to see TT draft a little more beef here? Yes, but let's give the unit (especially with the new guys and the returning players) a chance to perform next season... and then evaluate them. We also have the best running back group Rodgers has seen his entire career. The symbiotic relationship goes both ways... these new runners will help our O-line look good.

Question, Duck... When was the last time you saw this finesse McCarthy zone blocking unit go out there and dominate the line of scrimmage? It's OK--I can wait... In generality--football players have brains about the size of walnuts. The most direct route to beating a team is putting a BEATING on them. That's what they best understand...and everything feeds forth from what happens up front. Jimmy Johnson understood that well. Troy Aikman--HOF material? My ass. Emmitt Smith--best RB in league history? Keep me in stitches, bitch... That team just went out and demoralized the opposition through its ability to hammer its will up front on anyone they played...

I can live with the two guards. I can probably roll with Bulaga at RT...but Center and LT are major holes to fill--unless you think the 28 or whatever pressures and double-digit sacks charged to Marshall Newhouse is acceptable...and an answer needs to be aggressively pursued. Sherrod doesn't impress me. Never has. Barclay is just a guy who did an acceptable job in a tough situation. Bottom line: Free agency and the draft have pretty much come/gone--and I still don't see a LT on that fucking roster that carries the sack to start for the Green Bay Packers protecting the blind side of the most valuable asset the league has ever seen--and there's something wrong there for that to happen... Very wrong.


You lament TT's lack of participation in free agency, but let's not forget that last year he signed Benson and Saturday. The former had a noticeably positive effect on the offense until he went down. Saturday of course was past his expiration date. However, at the time we applauded both moves as TT deviating from his rigidity.


Hindsight is always 20/20. Yes--both of those moves were, at the time, laudible...


You feel that TT had "less than diligent proaction in trimming underperforming contracts from the roster." Well, the one player whose performance-to-pay ratio was clearly the worst on the team was Charles Woodson, and while many of us soured on him as early as 2011, you were in his corner all of last year!


Still am. They trimmed Woodson one year too soon. I wouldn't be surprised to see him come back, in fact. They could have extracted a significant pay cut out of him and benefitted immensely from his play/leadership. Don't buy into the GB media's bullshit, Duck. You're eating the shit off the bottom of the Fox river that the organization has distributed there for you to dine on... Is he the Woodson of his prime? NO. Is he still better than probably 75-80% of the Safeties out there? Fucking right.


Don't get me wrong. I'm not heaping lavish praise on TT or saying he was at the top of his game. I would agree that he's probably slipped a bit since the Super Bowl. I just think you're being a little too broad in your condemnations.

Hopefully he's bringing his A game this year. So far the draft and his handling of the Rodgers contract look pretty good to me.

I don't think Green Bay is in bad shape at all going into 2013. The biggest concern IMHO is that the Niners, Seahawks and Vikings have done more in the last two years to improve themselves!

_HD_ wrote:

duck wrote:

_HD_ wrote:

duck wrote:

_HD_ wrote:The official numbers for Rodgers' deal reached the NFLPA and, according to a source, the data shows that Rodgers received a $35 million signing bonus that is spread over the first five years of the contract. They lowered his base salary from $9.75 million to $4.5 million (plus $500,000 workout), so his cap number for 2013 is $12 million.

Since he was already counting $9.75 million against the cap, the Packers only lost $2.25 million of cap space.

As of Friday they were $15.48 million under the cap, so they are now $13.23 million under.

Rodgers' five-year extension came in at $110 million of new money as we reported here first on Friday.

What are the Packers going to do with all that cap space?

Well, at least $5 million will go to their 11 draft choices.

After that, they have the option of extending the contracts of NT B.J. Raji, CB Sam Shields, WR James Jones and anybody else they view as a priority. Or they have the option of carrying the salary cap space over to the 2014 season to help them deal with the increases they'll face on Rodgers' and LB Clay Matthews' deals.

The Packers were able to limit their cap responsibility this year by using a huge amount of cash to pay off Rodgers and Matthews.

Rodgers received a $35 million signing bonus and Matthews received $20.5 million. That means the Packers paid out $55.5 million to their two stars. That's not chump change, but when you made $42.7 million in profit last year and probably will make that or more this year, it's nothing that will bankrupt the organzation.

Rodgers' salary cap numbers are $12 milion in '13, $17.9 million in '14, $18.6 million in '15, $19.8 million in '16, $20.65 million in '17, $20.9 million in '18 and $21.1 million in '19.

This was actually artfully handled. The $17.9M in '14 onward will give them a sharp sting--but there is no bullshit balloon in this extension--so the Pack can readily bring down Rodgers' cap hit each year he looks to continue to be productive by dropping his salary and writing a roster bonus check to make up the difference--which can be prorated over the remaining life of the deal. Well done.

Not bad for a one trick pony, eh?

Yes--that and what looks to be a more typical Thompson draft certainly is a hopeful sign that he's he's starting to come out of the funk he's been in largely since the Pack won the SuperBowl. The jury is still out--but the last two drafts prior to this one have been mostly forgettable and free agency, of course, MIA... Add in the very poor roster/cap decisions on Driver, Jennings (Vikings saved his ass) etc and his less than diligent proaction in trimming underperforming contracts from the roster--and the B player has been no better than a C up until very recently. There's still no excuse for that O-line and the draft certainly provided no near term answers--and somebody needs to be shot if they start the regular season with a kicker like Crosby... Just too damn many games next year with a line of +/- 3 to have a kicker who you can't rely upon to put 3 up when you most need them...

Agreed with Driver and Jennings. Emphatically agreed with Crosby. The thought I've dreaded his entire career is him lining up for a 45-yard FG with the Packers' playoff fate on the line. After last year that thought has morphed into a wake-up-in-cold-sweat nightmare. I'd be much more comfortable with your average midget European soccer player.

I understand Thor pimps them out. $59.95--or just go wiith the six punch pass. PFKIA can serve as a reference--no doubt...

However, I think you've taken out that broad brush again, HD. I'm not whining about them because it's part of the game, but I really think much of Green Bay's slide from the top last year can be explained by injuries. Think of it, the last three number one picks (Perry, Sherrod and Bulaga) went down. Our O-line might not be so shaky if we had the latter two and frankly, it's a testament to our developmental program that Barclay was able to step in and contribute. Would I like to see TT draft a little more beef here? Yes, but let's give the unit (especially with the new guys and the returning players) a chance to perform next season... and then evaluate them. We also have the best running back group Rodgers has seen his entire career. The symbiotic relationship goes both ways... these new runners will help our O-line look good.

Question, Duck... When was the last time you saw this finesse McCarthy zone blocking unit go out there and dominate the line of scrimmage? It's OK--I can wait... In generality--football players have brains about the size of walnuts. The most direct route to beating a team is putting a BEATING on them. That's what they best understand...and everything feeds forth from what happens up front. Jimmy Johnson understood that well. Troy Aikman--HOF material? My ass. Emmitt Smith--best RB in league history? Keep me in stitches, bitch... That team just went out and demoralized the opposition through its ability to hammer its will up front on anyone they played...

I can live with the two guards. I can probably roll with Bulaga at RT...but Center and LT are major holes to fill--unless you think the 28 or whatever pressures and double-digit sacks charged to Marshall Newhouse is acceptable...and an answer needs to be aggressively pursued. Sherrod doesn't impress me. Never has. Barclay is just a guy who did an acceptable job in a tough situation. Bottom line: Free agency and the draft have pretty much come/gone--and I still don't see a LT on that fucking roster that carries the sack to start for the Green Bay Packers protecting the blind side of the most valuable asset the league has ever seen--and there's something wrong there for that to happen... Very wrong.

Yeah, the Newhouse situation scares the crap out of me. You can argue that for a pass-happy team with the best QB in the entire league, the LT position would be the SECOND most important on the entire team. We need some quality protecting Rodgers' blind side.


You lament TT's lack of participation in free agency, but let's not forget that last year he signed Benson and Saturday. The former had a noticeably positive effect on the offense until he went down. Saturday of course was past his expiration date. However, at the time we applauded both moves as TT deviating from his rigidity.


Hindsight is always 20/20. Yes--both of those moves were, at the time, laudible...


You feel that TT had "less than diligent proaction in trimming underperforming contracts from the roster." Well, the one player whose performance-to-pay ratio was clearly the worst on the team was Charles Woodson, and while many of us soured on him as early as 2011, you were in his corner all of last year!


Still am. They trimmed Woodson one year too soon. I wouldn't be surprised to see him come back, in fact. They could have extracted a significant pay cut out of him and benefitted immensely from his play/leadership. Don't buy into the GB media's bullshit, Duck. You're eating the shit off the bottom of the Fox river that the organization has distributed there for you to dine on... Is he the Woodson of his prime? NO. Is he still better than probably 75-80% of the Safeties out there? Fucking right.

I wish you were right but I strongly disagree. Woodson has dropped dramatically, IMHO. It may not just be his declining athleticism either. He could be affected by his recent spate of injuries. I don't see him in the top quarter of safeties in the league; in fact I'd say he's below average. The man has no wheels anymore.

And i'm not the only one who's observed that. Even the broadcasters noticed that in the playoffs.


Don't get me wrong. I'm not heaping lavish praise on TT or saying he was at the top of his game. I would agree that he's probably slipped a bit since the Super Bowl. I just think you're being a little too broad in your condemnations.

Hopefully he's bringing his A game this year. So far the draft and his handling of the Rodgers contract look pretty good to me.

I don't think Green Bay is in bad shape at all going into 2013. The biggest concern IMHO is that the Niners, Seahawks and Vikings have done more in the last two years to improve themselves!

From a personnel standpoint they each have... Niners and Seahawks have marginal coaches but exemplary GM's stocking the cupboards. Vikings have what is among the worst head coaches in the league and a puzzling GM. I really wonder who is/has been in control there. Some of his moves are extremely insightful--and others just don't seem like they possibly could have any linear connection to the same man... The bottom line, of course, is they have no QB. You see--you can have the best RB that maybe the league has ever seen--but with no QB--you go nowhere. Just ask AP... Niners and Hawks will be formidable this coming season. Two best teams in the league because their GM's have secured the horses and left very few holes...

_HD_ wrote:I agree with most of this except, once again, we disagree about Harbaugh. I think he's a damn good coach. He sure fucked up his play-calling at the end of the Super Bowl but all in all I think he's a solid game coach. He may have betrayed Alex Smith but he sold his team on it and there seems to be no negative ramifications. The best thing he does is he sells his brand of football to his players and they feed off of his energy. Frankly, I wish MM would show some fire like that.


Once again--I don't do black/white. I didn't say he was without merit as a coach. I said he was marginal... He shows you constantly that's what he truly thinks of himself...
I'm not quite sure how to put this to you, Duck, so you'll understand... Let me try this: Some people are Classic...and some people are Fads... Some people's qualities withstand the test of time and, indeed, like a fine wine--blend into something even better as they age...and some people's qualities turn sour and expire within the bounds of their freshness date. Jimbo has done well for himself given his background--but at the day's end, he's a naked man in a cheap suit whining because he thought he could have been awarded a better fucking tie...

duck wrote:

_HD_ wrote:I agree with most of this except, once again, we disagree about Harbaugh. I think he's a damn good coach. He sure fucked up his play-calling at the end of the Super Bowl but all in all I think he's a solid game coach. He may have betrayed Alex Smith but he sold his team on it and there seems to be no negative ramifications. The best thing he does is he sells his brand of football to his players and they feed off of his energy. Frankly, I wish MM would show some fire like that.


Once again--I don't do black/white. I didn't say he was without merit as a coach. I said he was marginal... He shows you constantly that's what he truly thinks of himself...
I'm not quite sure how to put this to you, Duck, so you'll understand... Let me try this: Some people are Classic...and some people are Fads... Some people's qualities withstand the test of time and, indeed, like a fine wine--blend into something even better as they age...and some people's qualities turn sour and expire within the bounds of their freshness date. Jimbo has done well for himself given his background--but at the day's end, he's a naked man in a cheap suit whining because he thought he could have been awarded a better fucking tie...

No, you don't do black and white, HD... you're far too smart for that. However, like most of us, you tend to fixate on early judgments. With respect to Jimmy, this naked man in a cheap suit may very well win another Coach of the Year award and get his team a Super Bowl ring before our illustrious fat man does.

I'm not saying he doesn't have warts or shortcomings, but I'm baffled at the disrespect you show for a guy who is doing a great coaching job.

_HD_ wrote:

duck wrote:

_HD_ wrote:I agree with most of this except, once again, we disagree about Harbaugh. I think he's a damn good coach. He sure fucked up his play-calling at the end of the Super Bowl but all in all I think he's a solid game coach. He may have betrayed Alex Smith but he sold his team on it and there seems to be no negative ramifications. The best thing he does is he sells his brand of football to his players and they feed off of his energy. Frankly, I wish MM would show some fire like that.


Once again--I don't do black/white. I didn't say he was without merit as a coach. I said he was marginal... He shows you constantly that's what he truly thinks of himself...
I'm not quite sure how to put this to you, Duck, so you'll understand... Let me try this: Some people are Classic...and some people are Fads... Some people's qualities withstand the test of time and, indeed, like a fine wine--blend into something even better as they age...and some people's qualities turn sour and expire within the bounds of their freshness date. Jimbo has done well for himself given his background--but at the day's end, he's a naked man in a cheap suit whining because he thought he could have been awarded a better fucking tie...

No, you don't do black and white, HD... you're far too smart for that. However, like most of us, you tend to fixate on early judgments. With respect to Jimmy, this naked man in a cheap suit may very well win another Coach of the Year award and get his team a Super Bowl ring before our illustrious fat man does.

I'm not saying he doesn't have warts or shortcomings, but I'm baffled at the disrespect you show for a guy who is doing a great coaching job.

...and there we come full circle. I disagree that Jimbo has done a great coaching job. You say the guy's team went to the SuperBowl--therefore he's a great coach. Wrong. By winning percentage, Barry Switzer is the greatest coach to ever grace the Dallas Cowboys, right? He stepped in his very first year and won a superbowl...he's got to be the best coach ever, right? Equally wrong. At a certain level--it becomes all about the horses, my friend, and with what Jimmy Johnson built there is Dallas--that fucking team could have coached itself (which is what it did) to win the dance in '94...

Baalke has utterly stocked that team with talent. He utilizes the draft and free agency equally well. My point is the talent level there mitigates other shortcomings. Jimbo is generally a decent coach. Jimbo will never be a great coach. Observe him closely, Duck. It's all there.

duck wrote:

_HD_ wrote:

duck wrote:

_HD_ wrote:I agree with most of this except, once again, we disagree about Harbaugh. I think he's a damn good coach. He sure fucked up his play-calling at the end of the Super Bowl but all in all I think he's a solid game coach. He may have betrayed Alex Smith but he sold his team on it and there seems to be no negative ramifications. The best thing he does is he sells his brand of football to his players and they feed off of his energy. Frankly, I wish MM would show some fire like that.


Once again--I don't do black/white. I didn't say he was without merit as a coach. I said he was marginal... He shows you constantly that's what he truly thinks of himself...
I'm not quite sure how to put this to you, Duck, so you'll understand... Let me try this: Some people are Classic...and some people are Fads... Some people's qualities withstand the test of time and, indeed, like a fine wine--blend into something even better as they age...and some people's qualities turn sour and expire within the bounds of their freshness date. Jimbo has done well for himself given his background--but at the day's end, he's a naked man in a cheap suit whining because he thought he could have been awarded a better fucking tie...

No, you don't do black and white, HD... you're far too smart for that. However, like most of us, you tend to fixate on early judgments. With respect to Jimmy, this naked man in a cheap suit may very well win another Coach of the Year award and get his team a Super Bowl ring before our illustrious fat man does.

I'm not saying he doesn't have warts or shortcomings, but I'm baffled at the disrespect you show for a guy who is doing a great coaching job.

...and there we come full circle. I disagree that Jimbo has done a great coaching job. You say the guy's team went to the SuperBowl--therefore he's a great coach. Wrong. By winning percentage, Barry Switzer is the greatest coach to ever grace the Dallas Cowboys, right? He stepped in his very first year and won a superbowl...he's got to be the best coach ever, right? Equally wrong. At a certain level--it becomes all about the horses, my friend, and with what Jimmy Johnson built there is Dallas--that fucking team could have coached itself (which is what it did) to win the dance in '94...

Baalke has utterly stocked that team with talent. He utilizes the draft and free agency equally well. My point is the talent level there mitigates other shortcomings. Jimbo is generally a decent coach. Jimbo will never be a great coach. Observe him closely, Duck. It's all there.

You make a valid point that sometimes a mediocre or even shitty coach can win it all if he's loaded with talent. Switzer proved that. However, just because a coach has good players and a strong front office, that doesn't necessarily discount his coaching ability. They are not mutually exclusive.

Harbaugh has been a winner wherever he's gone as a head coach. He kicked butt in the Pioneer football league. He resurrected the Stanford Cardinal and led them to its highest ever national college ranking of #4. And his record with the Niners is an impressive 24-7-1, starting out with essentially the same group Singletary led into the dumpster. His Coach of the Year award says something too.

I guess we can disagree on this but in my mind he's much better than "decent"... I'd say he's pretty damned good.

_HD_ wrote:Speak of the devil--here's a good example of what I'm talking about, Duck. What do Jimbo's comments highlighted in red below suggest about him?


49ers rookie Quinton Patton shows up too early for work, sent home


Posted by Mike Wilkening on May 1, 2013, 10:47 PM EDT
[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] Getty Images
Yes, you read that correctly.

49ers rookie wide receiver [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], eager to begin work with his new team, flew from Nashville to San Francisco at his own expense Monday to work out with the club. However, head coach Jim Harbaugh sent the fourth-round pick from Louisiana Tech home before he arrived at the club’s facilities.

According to Harbaugh, who [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] on KNBR-AM in San Francisco on Wednesday, Patton would not have been able to take part in the club’s minicamp from May 10 through May 12 if he arrived this week. According to Harbaugh, NFL rookies can be present at a club’s facilities right after they are drafted, but Patton was arriving after that period of time. (For those interested in hearing the story, it begins about the eight-minute mark at the above link.)

Harbaugh joked that Patton’s trip was “probably the best money that he’s ever spent,” given how the story would now be associated with his desire to play the game.

But Harbaugh’s respect for the rookie is clear.

“The fact that he would buy his own ticket, fly out here, just to me speaks volumes about him,” Harbaugh said. “I mean, to be honest with you, he reminds me of me. That’s something I would have done.”

Safe to say that Quinton Patton’s NFL career is off to a nice start.

_HD_ wrote:Speak of the devil--here's a good example of what I'm talking about, Duck. What do Jimbo's comments highlighted in red below suggest about him?


49ers rookie Quinton Patton shows up too early for work, sent home


Posted by Mike Wilkening on May 1, 2013, 10:47 PM EDT
[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] Getty Images
Yes, you read that correctly.

49ers rookie wide receiver [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], eager to begin work with his new team, flew from Nashville to San Francisco at his own expense Monday to work out with the club. However, head coach Jim Harbaugh sent the fourth-round pick from Louisiana Tech home before he arrived at the club’s facilities.

According to Harbaugh, who [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] on KNBR-AM in San Francisco on Wednesday, Patton would not have been able to take part in the club’s minicamp from May 10 through May 12 if he arrived this week. According to Harbaugh, NFL rookies can be present at a club’s facilities right after they are drafted, but Patton was arriving after that period of time. (For those interested in hearing the story, it begins about the eight-minute mark at the above link.)

Harbaugh joked that Patton’s trip was “probably the best money that he’s ever spent,” given how the story would now be associated with his desire to play the game.

But Harbaugh’s respect for the rookie is clear.

“The fact that he would buy his own ticket, fly out here, just to me speaks volumes about him,” Harbaugh said. “I mean, to be honest with you, he reminds me of me. That’s something I would have done.”

Safe to say that Quinton Patton’s NFL career is off to a nice start.

duck wrote:You were starting to roll with a couple of keys bundled in your sack until you had to go and and express fuck it all downtown with that *Coach of the Year* award, Duckley... That's an awfully flimsy noodle to take to the back seat of the limo on prom night, there hammerhound.


Surely you don't think it's a bad thing, do you, HD??

I would never cite that as my sole piece of information in support of a coach, but in conjunction with Harbaugh's other impressive achievements, I think it's a nice little cherry.

duck wrote:

_HD_ wrote:Speak of the devil--here's a good example of what I'm talking about, Duck. What do Jimbo's comments highlighted in red below suggest about him?


49ers rookie Quinton Patton shows up too early for work, sent home


Posted by Mike Wilkening on May 1, 2013, 10:47 PM EDT
[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] Getty Images
Yes, you read that correctly.

49ers rookie wide receiver [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], eager to begin work with his new team, flew from Nashville to San Francisco at his own expense Monday to work out with the club. However, head coach Jim Harbaugh sent the fourth-round pick from Louisiana Tech home before he arrived at the club’s facilities.

According to Harbaugh, who [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] on KNBR-AM in San Francisco on Wednesday, Patton would not have been able to take part in the club’s minicamp from May 10 through May 12 if he arrived this week. According to Harbaugh, NFL rookies can be present at a club’s facilities right after they are drafted, but Patton was arriving after that period of time. (For those interested in hearing the story, it begins about the eight-minute mark at the above link.)

Harbaugh joked that Patton’s trip was “probably the best money that he’s ever spent,” given how the story would now be associated with his desire to play the game.

But Harbaugh’s respect for the rookie is clear.

“The fact that he would buy his own ticket, fly out here, just to me speaks volumes about him,” Harbaugh said. “I mean, to be honest with you, he reminds me of me. That’s something I would have done.”

Safe to say that Quinton Patton’s NFL career is off to a nice start.

What do I think about Jimbo's comments? I think it shows he has a sense of humor and can be self-effacing at times. He can be a very colorful interview.

_HD_ wrote:

duck wrote:

_HD_ wrote:Speak of the devil--here's a good example of what I'm talking about, Duck. What do Jimbo's comments highlighted in red below suggest about him?


49ers rookie Quinton Patton shows up too early for work, sent home


Posted by Mike Wilkening on May 1, 2013, 10:47 PM EDT
[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] Getty Images
Yes, you read that correctly.

49ers rookie wide receiver [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], eager to begin work with his new team, flew from Nashville to San Francisco at his own expense Monday to work out with the club. However, head coach Jim Harbaugh sent the fourth-round pick from Louisiana Tech home before he arrived at the club’s facilities.

According to Harbaugh, who [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] on KNBR-AM in San Francisco on Wednesday, Patton would not have been able to take part in the club’s minicamp from May 10 through May 12 if he arrived this week. According to Harbaugh, NFL rookies can be present at a club’s facilities right after they are drafted, but Patton was arriving after that period of time. (For those interested in hearing the story, it begins about the eight-minute mark at the above link.)

Harbaugh joked that Patton’s trip was “probably the best money that he’s ever spent,” given how the story would now be associated with his desire to play the game.

But Harbaugh’s respect for the rookie is clear.

“The fact that he would buy his own ticket, fly out here, just to me speaks volumes about him,” Harbaugh said. “I mean, to be honest with you, he reminds me of me. That’s something I would have done.”

Safe to say that Quinton Patton’s NFL career is off to a nice start.

What do I think about Jimbo's comments? I think it shows he has a sense of humor and can be self-effacing at times. He can be a very colorful interview.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]